For next week I would like to discuss
The Distancing Question in Online Education
Glenn Russel http://www.innovateonline.info/index.php?view=article&id=13
Breaking the Barriers of Time and Space:More Effective Teaching Using e-Pedagogy
by Peshe Kuriloff http://www.innovateonline.info/index.php?view=article&id=64
Beyond PowerPoint:Visual Presentation Tools for Online Learning
by Bruce Howerton http://www.innovateonline.info/index.php?view=article&id=9
Using Instant Messaging for Collaborative Learning:A Case Study
by Susana M. Sotillo http://www.innovateonline.info/index.php?view=article&id=170
Designing Instructional Articles in Online Courses for Adult Learners
by D. Verne Morland and Herbert Bivens http://www.innovateonline.info/index.php?view=article&id=8
The Future of Course Redesign and the National Center for Academic Transformation:An Interview with Carol A. Twigg
by William H. Graves and Carol A. Twigg http://www.innovateonline.info/index.php?view=article&id=218&action=article
I have read these. I'm very interested in your take on them, Janie. I see these as having great relevance to UDL and to your work.
ReplyDeleteChat transcript for this discussion.
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Rich Rice: good morning
Janie Santoy: hi
Rich Rice: good week?
Janie Santoy: very long, 14 hours in a car is not fun, takes its toll
Rich Rice: yikes. Where did you go?
Janie Santoy: I have fallen a bit behind; didn't anticipate my trip to Waco would be so intensive
Rich Rice: k.
Rich Rice: shall we discuss the articles, or...?
Janie Santoy: but I have gotten a better concept of how Vista will affect the design of the class
Janie Santoy: basically, it will be very difficult for me to track anything outside of Vista
Rich Rice: nods
Rich Rice: well, that's good to know
Janie Santoy: It is possible but have to work closely with my IT folk and I suspect that will be difficult to organize
Rich Rice: tracking, of course, isn't everything...and you could come up with a quick commentary/survey after each learning unit
Rich Rice: which would be andragogic...
Janie Santoy: especially as things get busy for them
Janie Santoy: yes, vista has the survey tool which would help with that
Rich Rice: in reading the UDL book, and many of the innovate pieces, methinks that will be important
Janie Santoy: I've been thinking about the distancing article and how UDL recommends tapping the affective domain via the delivery of content
Rich Rice: nods
Rich Rice: what sorts of tools would do that?
Janie Santoy: video, audio, images of some sort
Janie Santoy: but I think that even chunking and providing a glossary would help
Rich Rice: nods--so, giving students entry points into the material that is more emotional
Rich Rice: nods
Rich Rice: andragogy article talked about that with moodle
Rich Rice: need to let users choose in ways that they need to...
Janie Santoy: so that there are subtle ways that one can use in the design of the content
Janie Santoy: So I'm questioning my goal to use Spanish translations
Janie Santoy: I know that some students would be offended by this if it is too blatant and distracting
Rich Rice: what percent of your students are spanish speakers?
Janie Santoy: I would say at least 60% if not more.
Rich Rice: I wonder if there are ways to not make spanish secondary... not design the site in spanish, but not make it seem like "oh, if you'd rather read in your native language, click here"
Rich Rice: know what I mean?
Rich Rice: somehow more integrative
Rich Rice: maybe with quotes in spanish on every page
Rich Rice: have I shown you e-tips by longman yet?
Janie Santoy: The problem is that many speak spanish but cannot necessarily read it
Janie Santoy: etips, no
Rich Rice: ah
Rich Rice: maybe sound then
Rich Rice: well, etips is very affective
Rich Rice: useful
Rich Rice: http://www.ablongman.com/textbooktips
Rich Rice: take a look at the third one down, tackling the college paper
Rich Rice: you see video, graphic, sound, text on the same page
Rich Rice: done with flash
Rich Rice: give you ideas?
Janie Santoy: Interesting
Rich Rice: yeah, affective
Rich Rice: students speaking to students
Janie Santoy: so designing interaction would also have an affective component
Rich Rice: thought about this site when reading chapter 8 in udl
Rich Rice: nods
Rich Rice: andragogic--students decide the avenue they need to get motivated
Rich Rice: where are you with the syll?
Janie Santoy: do you mean with the order of activities?
Rich Rice: y
Janie Santoy: Not very far. I'm going to be doing the dreamweaver tutorial this week which will help me think of design
Janie Santoy: pretty the syllabus is still the same as the proposal
Janie Santoy: pretty much
Rich Rice: k. Sounds good.
Rich Rice: what did you think about the distancing question in online education piece?
Rich Rice: that is, the affective can compensate...
Rich Rice: that's the primary reason I do videos and our program does synchronous
Janie Santoy: I think it is easy for students to feel alienated and for the instructor to do nothing
Rich Rice: enables responsiveness to students' actions
Rich Rice: yes
Rich Rice: true
Rich Rice: how will your course compensate?
Janie Santoy: so it has to be a conscious effort not only druing the design
Janie Santoy: but during the delivery itsel
Rich Rice: nods. This is one reason why I've gone to weekly, manditory, blogs, with manditory responses to others
Janie Santoy: since I'm not going to have synchronous discussion this time, at least not to start off,
Janie Santoy: I can pose that as a choice for students, maybe
Rich Rice: I often do that.... a sort of optional meeting time to chat
Rich Rice: and the idea is to chat informally, not so much about content
Rich Rice: support
Rich Rice: but you have to worry about priviledging some over others
Rich Rice: maybe some students work
Rich Rice: families
Rich Rice: obligations
Rich Rice: some won't have time
Janie Santoy: one article talked about alternating times
Rich Rice: nods
Janie Santoy: to be more avialble to students
Rich Rice: like a sort of commonplace
Rich Rice: I think building in, systematically, recognition of their interests... like the jobs they want.
Rich Rice: which can be done through assignments
Rich Rice: builds on respect and affective
Rich Rice: I do pictures....
Rich Rice: that something you're considering or not?
Rich Rice: some people prefer not to have their pictures up...
Janie Santoy: I was thinking of how to incorporate those 4 types of evaluation tools the androgogy article talks about
Rich Rice: nods
Janie Santoy: Pictures. I think they are important.
Rich Rice: how has seeing your peers in our class affected you?
Janie Santoy: I especially like them tied to the blogs because you have the face as youre reading the comment
Janie Santoy: seems more personal when the picture is there
Rich Rice: yes
Rich Rice: yeah, and their content (the ePortfolios from last semester)
Rich Rice: Adults need to know why they need to learn something.
Adults need to learn experientially.
Adults approach learning as problem-solving.
Adults learn best when [they believe that] the topic is of immediate value.
Rich Rice: these the ones?
Janie Santoy: seeing....as in meeting them or seeing their pictures
Janie Santoy: case studies/role playing/simulations/self-evalutation
Rich Rice: nods--a visual handshake
Rich Rice: ah
Janie Santoy: Incorporating these means redesigning the assignments for the class
Rich Rice: yes, I honestly think these are strategies we need to use more of in our teaching in general
Janie Santoy: not necessarily the schedule
Rich Rice: would be a lot of change to the assignments?
Rich Rice: what's the first one?
Janie Santoy: synthesis
Janie Santoy: I would have to rethink the way I present the assignment
Janie Santoy: the choices I give them;
Janie Santoy: have to be more open and less prescriptive
Rich Rice: good principle in general I think
Janie Santoy: which also involves more time, if I let them decide have to give them time to work it out
Rich Rice: harder to assess
Janie Santoy: which means have to rethink the assessment portion of the assignment to make sure it is appropriate
Rich Rice: well, it's your class. But, I think bringing in case studies and other types of assignments is helpful.
Rich Rice: also, the work your students do now
Rich Rice: if it's recorded
Rich Rice: can become case study examples in the future
Rich Rice: similar to how you looked at assignments from previous grant writing classes...
Rich Rice: maybe
Janie Santoy: right, which requires much planning, forethought and follow through
Rich Rice: this isn't easy.
Janie Santoy: something I need to keep in mind while I teach
Rich Rice: well, nice thing about andragogy and udl....
Rich Rice: you build in much reflection
Rich Rice: why did you do what you do?
Janie Santoy: I mean not lose track because then I have to start over, sort of
Rich Rice: makes a nice introduction to an artifact
Rich Rice: right, I see what you mean
Rich Rice: no, the course needs to build, organically, over a few offerings
Rich Rice: a smart course
Janie Santoy: exactly
Rich Rice: then the content becomes entrenched in the lives of the students
Rich Rice: because the content becomes their lives
Janie Santoy: I tried this concept with a basic tech writing class I taught last semester and it worked really well
Janie Santoy: engaged the students
Rich Rice: nice. Do you see it as the direction here maybe?
Janie Santoy: I think even they were surprised by their output and their learning
Janie Santoy: which was nice to see
Janie Santoy: but I found that there was alot of resistance at the beginning
Rich Rice: hmm, interesting
Janie Santoy: they just wanted me to tell them what to do so could get it done and go
Rich Rice: right--that's the pedagogy vs. andragogy battle
Rich Rice: as our students are moving from one camp to the next
Janie Santoy: it was a 2 hr theory and 4 hr lab class
Rich Rice: interesting
Rich Rice: you can gaurantee certain levels of learning when you tell it to them
Rich Rice: but
Rich Rice: you can only get so far
Rich Rice: when it becomes intrinsically engaging
Rich Rice: then students take off
Rich Rice: I'd say most of the students in grant writing really took off
Rich Rice: some didn't
Janie Santoy: well you can't save them all...
Rich Rice:
Rich Rice: I'm reading your blog on the courses you've taken right now...
Rich Rice: you're talking about the value of video for consistency
Rich Rice: is that something you're interested in doing?
Janie Santoy: yes
Rich Rice: I've been thinking a lot about that lately...
Rich Rice: much of grant writing is prescriptive
Rich Rice: frontloading
Rich Rice: lots of information first, then go write
Rich Rice: videos are conducive to that
Rich Rice: would be for one sort of approach to classical, too
Rich Rice: but there's too much information for classical
Rich Rice: to cover I'd have to have hour-long vids
Rich Rice: so, I'm switching the approach
Rich Rice: and, the class moves so fast
Janie Santoy: adn then what would do in class?
Rich Rice: right
Rich Rice: so, the vids are more like
Rich Rice: what I felt we were weak on
Rich Rice: review
Janie Santoy: this is what we didnt get...
Rich Rice: right
Rich Rice: different
Rich Rice: still useful I think for seeing the teacher
Rich Rice: knowing the teacher is working and not just regurgitating
Janie Santoy: providing support
Rich Rice: right
Rich Rice: different tool
Rich Rice: takes a lot of work
Rich Rice: I wonder, though...
Rich Rice: if a combination would be useful
Rich Rice: that is....
Rich Rice: could create ahead of time a series of videos
Rich Rice: that are basically you talking through content
Rich Rice: for each week
Rich Rice: that can be done in advance
Rich Rice: but...
Rich Rice: slap on a three minute or so talking head at the beginning
Rich Rice: of each video before making it available
Rich Rice: produced that week
Rich Rice: to pick up on the students' direction
Rich Rice: make sense?
Janie Santoy: yes
Rich Rice: so, you'd have a set of already-prepped videos that could cover content basics, but would have an on-the-fly created introduction
Rich Rice: works in scale, too
Rich Rice: any teacher could do the on-the-fly
Rich Rice: with the already prepared material
Janie Santoy: but alot of what we do in class
Rich Rice: maybe splice in talking head here and there for consistency
Rich Rice: right
Janie Santoy: is work through what the content is about
Rich Rice: that way you're not creating a new vid every week, every semester
Rich Rice: right
Janie Santoy: with you leading (mostly) the discussion
Rich Rice: eventually you could work in examples of students (given their permission to use their work in this way)
Janie Santoy: if you did the videos then how the student lead discussions work?
Janie Santoy: wouldn't some of that be repetitious?
Rich Rice: well, I'm conceiving these as being watched prior to a class meeting
Rich Rice: student led discussions could be prompts from students, maybe from blogs
Rich Rice: so, I could have a 20-minute lecture
Rich Rice: put my face on the front, then splice in quotes from student blogs
Rich Rice: then it's sort of "led" by the class
Rich Rice: but this is different than what we're doing now in classical
Rich Rice: I do like student-led better
Rich Rice: but not sure if this would work for your class
Rich Rice: too many students...
Rich Rice: content is not as concise
Rich Rice: don't know. What do you think?
Janie Santoy: wow. I was wondering when I would be able to get a word in
Janie Santoy: well, UDL says alternate form of delivery; not alternate form of delivery with alternate content
Rich Rice: (sorry, I get excited about the possibilities)
Janie Santoy: I have to make sure that I don't have all these cool tools which the students need to go to to get all the content
Rich Rice: right
Janie Santoy: I want to be able to give them a choice of how they receive the information
Janie Santoy: if text is good enough for them then OK
Janie Santoy: but the others are available if they need them
Janie Santoy: I have to devise a way to get them to experiment at the beginning so they get a feel
Janie Santoy: for the array of choices they have
Janie Santoy: but my goal is to provide the same things in each
Janie Santoy: unit
Janie Santoy: and not change what and how I provide it from unit to unit
Janie Santoy: consistency is important, i think
Rich Rice: so, something in text, in sound, in ppt, in vid maybe...for each unit, yes?
Janie Santoy: yes
Janie Santoy: all providing the same content
Rich Rice: makes sense
Rich Rice: a little different than how I use different media for grad courses
Rich Rice: content is different, oftentimes
Rich Rice: but I've done something similar with my undergrad DE courses
Rich Rice: same content, different media
Rich Rice: good way to maximize prep time, too
Janie Santoy: well, i think it is important that the students are not overwhelmed and that they know where to find what they need
Rich Rice: right
Rich Rice: my syllabi for grad classes are more like choose your own adventure
Rich Rice: okay, so what's next for us?
Janie Santoy: should have the shell for the course by the end of this week, I hope
Rich Rice: btw-- that section on gals and methods in the UDL book deals with this well: http://www.cast.org/teachingeverystudent/ideas/tes/chapter5_2.cfm
Rich Rice: shoot me an email when you have it and I'll take a look
Janie Santoy: I will.
Rich Rice: will you be working in Vista?
Janie Santoy: I have a question about the class rhet paper
Rich Rice: k
Janie Santoy: Vista yes.
Janie Santoy: but many of the apges will be designed in dreamweaver and then imported
Rich Rice: so, maybe I need a password, or maybe you do screen caps
Rich Rice: ah
Rich Rice: so that can be done outside
Janie Santoy: yes
Rich Rice: classical?
Rich Rice: Complete a 20-page term paper/project with instructor and peer support (due 8/7). Drafts and purpose negotiable as defined by the class. Your project should apply a classical rhetoric concept learned for a contemporary purpose. Use source material. (40%)
Janie Santoy: but discussion and other things will be in webct so I'lll get you access when we get there
Rich Rice: thanks
Janie Santoy: what exactly falls under "classical rhetoric concept"?
Rich Rice: ah.... well, some would argue anything as pretty much everything in western civ comes out of plato and aristotle...
Rich Rice: but I'm looking for some term that is expanded
Rich Rice: kairos...
Rich Rice: enthymeme
Rich Rice: stasis
Rich Rice: commonplace
Rich Rice: etc.
Rich Rice: pathos (if you wanted to study affective)
Rich Rice: any ideas?
Janie Santoy: and much of the paper will be research based?
Rich Rice: if you do a paper, yes--perhaps with a personal application section
Rich Rice: maybe 4-5 pages on that
Rich Rice: but the rest would be research-based
Rich Rice: idea is to give you fuel for your reading list
Janie Santoy: if website?
Rich Rice: if a site, then you'll write more like a 5 page analysis (or so) of the site, with screen shots
Rich Rice: should have some research involved, but not all
Rich Rice: one sec...
Rich Rice: ah, different...but sort of like the final project in http://www.faculty.english.ttu.edu/rice/5376/#assignments
Rich Rice: which type are you learning toward, paper or site/analysis?
Janie Santoy: the problem is I'm not leaning in either direction right now
Janie Santoy: I want to decide on my topic first
Janie Santoy: was thinking of kairos and online course delivery
Rich Rice: K a good topic....why don't we see what others are doing tonight in class, and that may help you decide some.
Janie Santoy: but also covering some intersting material in the intercultural communication which I would like to study further
Rich Rice: wow-this is interesting: https://www.luthersem.edu/lifelong_learning/kairos/
Rich Rice: well, K and intercultural go hand in hand
Rich Rice: here's a project another student of mine is working on... (one sec)
Janie Santoy: would like to see how these intersect; but what i see so far is that intercultural communication finds much of classical rhet problematic
Janie Santoy: almost all of what I have read is very critical
Rich Rice: http://www.grad.english.ttu.edu/mcmichael/intercult_comm/
Rich Rice: oh, can't remember the pword
Rich Rice: could email her
Rich Rice: loni
Rich Rice: it's on intercult
Rich Rice: classical rhetoric tends to be logocentric
Rich Rice: rather than looking toward multiple cultures
Rich Rice: Greece was a culture of assimulation
Rich Rice: not celebrating diversity
Janie Santoy: thanks
Rich Rice: http://english.ttu.edu/kairos/7.2/index.html
Rich Rice: see the Gajjala piece
Rich Rice: problem with server right now, but we'll fix
Rich Rice: anyway, might give you ideas
Janie Santoy: ok will try later
Janie Santoy: ok. have to get to work. thank
Janie Santoy: you
Rich Rice: okay. Have a nice day.
Your site is very helpful
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